Group scores mismatch from Top Groups page and individual Group's pages

Case number:671076-992083
Topic:Server
Opened by:pauldunn
Status:Open
Type:Bug
Opened on:Sunday, March 11, 2012 - 00:38
Last modified:Wednesday, July 17, 2019 - 04:43

The Top Group scores (https://fold.it/portal/groups) don't match the score on each of the Group's pages.

Rank Group Global Score
#1 Contenders 3931
#2 Anthropic Dreams 3728
#3 Void Crushers 3066
#4 Go Science 3054
#5 foldeRNA 2597

https://fold.it/portal/node/985857
Contenders
Global Rank: #1
Global Score: 4,687

https://fold.it/portal/node/987632
Anthropic Dreams
Global Rank: #2
Global Score: 4,566

These score have mismatched for at least the last several puzzles.

(Sun, 03/11/2012 - 00:38  |  40 comments)


beta_helix's picture
User offline. Last seen 10 hours 7 min ago. Offline
Joined: 05/09/2008
Groups: None
Status: Open » Open

should be fixed now, please let us know if it isn't!

pauldunn's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 weeks 1 day ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2010
Groups: Go Science
Status: Open » Closed

It appears to be fixed.
Thanks

pauldunn's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 weeks 1 day ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2010
Groups: Go Science
Status: Closed » Open

Problem is back.

beta_helix's picture
User offline. Last seen 10 hours 7 min ago. Offline
Joined: 05/09/2008
Groups: None
Topic: General » Server
Status: Open » Open

thanks for reporting this, hopefully we can figure out once and for all why this keeps happening.

pauldunn's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 weeks 1 day ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2010
Groups: Go Science
Status: Open » Closed

Fixed.

pauldunn's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 weeks 1 day ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2010
Groups: Go Science
Status: Closed » Open

back again

Joined: 11/10/2007
Groups: Window Group
Status: Open » Closed

This appears to be resolved.

Joined: 09/19/2011
Groups: Beta Folders
Status: Closed » Open

It still appears to be an issue. My group page doesn't update automatically. The group is new and that makes the issue obvious.

My group page scores are usually only correct after admin updates it manually.

Thanks for checking it out. ;)

Angus's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 57 min ago. Offline
Joined: 06/04/2008
Groups: Beta Folders

The "My Page" solo ranks are zeros again, and the Players|Top Soloists ranks are all zeros.

pauldunn's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 weeks 1 day ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2010
Groups: Go Science
Status: Open » Closed

Closing

pauldunn's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 weeks 1 day ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2010
Groups: Go Science
Status: Closed » Open

Problem is back.

beta_helix's picture
User offline. Last seen 10 hours 7 min ago. Offline
Joined: 05/09/2008
Groups: None
Status: Open » Closed

I kicked the cron the it supposed to update this regularly.
Please let us know if it gets stuck again.

Thanks for your patience!

pauldunn's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 weeks 1 day ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2010
Groups: Go Science
Status: Closed » Open

Problem is back.

frood66's picture
User offline. Last seen 15 hours 51 min ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2011
Groups: Marvin's bunch

I did not realise this feedback existed...had posted a new one (now taken down)

The group scores is is still with us.

Joined: 06/06/2013
Groups: Gargleblasters

this doesn 't work. neither does the buddy list. we can't add new buddies. it would be easier to play evo if we could find our team mates
thanks

Joined: 04/24/2014
Groups: None

Be sure to add the buddy list as a new feedback, Skippy. :) For tracking purposes, when issues get buried inside of other issues, they often get lost - and we don't want that to happen.

Best,
inky

actiasluna's picture
User offline. Last seen 2 hours 15 min ago. Offline
Joined: 03/05/2015
Groups: Gargleblasters

Problem is definitely back.

Joined: 04/24/2014
Groups: None

We're currently looking into it. :)

frood66's picture
User offline. Last seen 15 hours 51 min ago. Offline
Joined: 09/20/2011
Groups: Marvin's bunch

if the old scoring issue is gonna be a problem to fix - then ditch it and just use the new one. Whatever, let's have a ranking/scoring system that works. Please?

Angus's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 57 min ago. Offline
Joined: 06/04/2008
Groups: Beta Folders

Can you explain what you mean by "old" and "new" scoring system?

Occasionally the scripts to update rankings doesn't run after a puzzle closes, but the points are there and the rankinga get updated eventually. (Sometimes it takes a nudge from here).

Joined: 04/24/2014
Groups: None

The scoring system is something on our list to discuss (hopefully today if we can get to it, if not definitely via emails).

Joined: 09/24/2012
Groups: Go Science

back again

Joined: 09/24/2012
Groups: Go Science
Status: Open » Closed

It seems to be ok now

Joined: 09/24/2012
Groups: Go Science
Status: Closed » Open

Back again

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

The groups is also lagging by day or so.

The current group score for Beta Folders is shown as 3,724, which is puzzles 1175-1223. Puzzle 1224, which closed a few hours ago is not counted, but puzzle 1175, which closed over 120 days ago, is counted.

The correct total is 3,705, according to my spreadsheet. This our total for puzzles 1176-1224.

The Beta Folders page shows 3,115. I have no idea where that number comes from, but it hasn't changed in a couple of weeks. See forum discussion of scoring and ranking.

Joined: 04/24/2014
Groups: None

Thanks for the link to the forum discussion, yeah. While I can't offer any insight to the timeline of fixing the score systems so they are consistent and reliable - I can say it's definitely on the list.

Joined: 09/24/2012
Groups: Go Science

Back again.

I understand from Loci"s comment that the score of the groups page is the correct one. :)

It shows:

1) Go Science 2587
2) Beta Folder 2574
3) Anthropic Dreams 2470
4) Gargleblasters 2353
etc.

If I start from the individual group pages, it gives:
1) Beta Folders 2745
2) Anthropic Dreams 2592
3) Gargleblasters 2521
4) Go Science 2358

actiasluna's picture
User offline. Last seen 2 hours 15 min ago. Offline
Joined: 03/05/2015
Groups: Gargleblasters

FWIW this mismatch persists... for example our individual group page has said 1903 points for many, many months. Our groups page score says 2436. Kind of worried to mention this as the last time I mentioned it, the site experienced a meltdown (possibly coincidentally).

By the way... as of today:

Top Groups
Search:
Rank Group Global Score
#1 Beta Folders 3428
#2 Anthropic Dreams 3273
#3 Go Science 2574
#4 Gargleblasters 2556
#5 Contenders 1662

Individual Group Pages
#1 Beta Folders 3335
#2 Anthropic Dreams 2981
#3 Contenders 2636
#4 Go Science 2060
#5 Gargleblasters 1903

actiasluna's picture
User offline. Last seen 2 hours 15 min ago. Offline
Joined: 03/05/2015
Groups: Gargleblasters

Now it's actually worse... This is how the groups page looks this morning. Numbers are wrong (two #5s with scores 400 points apart, and score appears to be the one from our incorrect individual group page. I guarantee 1903 is incorrect, it's the number that has persisted on that page - despite our group's recent puzzle scoring - for months.

Top Groups
Search:
Rank Group Global Score
#1 Beta Folders 3420
#2 Anthropic Dreams 3337
#4 Go Science 2528
#5 Contenders 1567
#5 Gargleblasters 1903
#6 L'Alliance Francophone 1106

actiasluna's picture
User offline. Last seen 2 hours 15 min ago. Offline
Joined: 03/05/2015
Groups: Gargleblasters

It would seem to me that the Groups and Group page scores should match and these scores would pull data automatically rather than being hand-entered... is this not the case?

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders
Topic: General » Server

I'm changing the topic to "server" to reflect where the problem is.

I screen-scraped the results for the top 10 groups into a spreadsheet. I did this today, 4 June 2019, outside of normal puzzle expiration times. I counted the scores for all puzzles in the last 120 days, puzzles 1630 to 1679 in the regular science puzzles, plus a few beginner puzzles that expired on 4 February 2019.

Of the top 10 groups, only Hold My Beer appears to have a correct score on the Groups page, with 503 global points.

I'm still checking my work, but I did the screen-scraping for Gargleblasters twice and got the same results.

I'll just show the results as a list for the moment:

group	total	Foldit	difference
Beta Folders	3442	3420	22
Anthropic Dreams	3411	3337	74
Gargleblasters	2975	1903	1072
Go Science	2638	2528	110
Contenders	2478	1567	911
Void Crushers	1120	1003	117
L'Alliance Francophone	1109	1106	3
Hun-Magyar Csapat	1083	512	571
Marvin's bunch	773	772	1
Hold My Beer	503	503	0

With a little luck, you can copy and paste these lines into your own spreadsheet. I'll make the full spreadsheet available at some point, please PM me if you want a copy in the mean time.

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

I was able to copy the results from the previous post, and paste into OpenOffice Calc.

When pasting, I right-clicked and select Paste Special... -> Unformatted text. This option brings up an "Import Text" dialog, which has a preview of the rows and columns. I accepted it with the default option, which uses the tab character as the delimiter.

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

OK, things got a little better, but overall, it's still a mess.

The good news is that the scores on the "Groups" page now match the scores on each individual group page, at least for the first 11 teams. A win for data integrity.

The Russian Team has now moved into the top 10.

The bad news is that the totals don't seem right. I've updated my spreadsheet to include the latest puzzles. According to my calculations, the 120 day window is 12 June 2019 to 12 February 2019, puzzles 1634 to 1682.

There are a couple of potential problems I've noted. The puzzle results pages on fold.it report a "last played" date. This is not necessarily the date the puzzle ended. The entries on the results pages seem to be in descending "last played" order. I've tried to take this into account, but still might be off by a puzzle or two in some cases.

I'm assuming the points actually get awarded when each puzzle expires. In other words, if you stopped playing puzzle 1633 on 10 February, you received the points on 12 February, and they didn't expire until 12 June.

Beginner puzzles are another potential issue. They run a long time, and may appear out of sequence due to the "last played" issue. I've tried to fix a few cases where it was obvious, but I may not have found them all. Also, a couple of beginner puzzles may have gotten points since the last update that aren't counted here. I'll try to figure this out for the next revision, but I think we're talking only a few points here and there.

Here are the current totals from my spreadsheet, along with the Foldit numbers from the groups page. I don't see a easy explanation for the large discrepancies on some of these. Once again, the table below can be copied and pasted into a spreadsheet for easier viewing. PM me if you want the full spreadsheet.

rank	team	total	Foldit total	difference
1	Beta Folders	3403	3403	0
2	Anthropic Dreams	3222	3193	29
3	Gargleblasters	2903	1485	1418
4	Go Science	2735	2648	87
5	Contenders	1673	2540	-867
6	Hun-Magyar Csapat	1086	519	567
7	Void Crushers	1076	1019	57
8	L'Alliance Francophone	1063	1097	-34
9	Russian Team	789	463	326
10	Marvin's bunch	780	801	-21
11	Hold My Beer	419	425	-6

(Edit: changed the puzzle range. Puzzle 1633 should have just expired when I collected my numbers, puzzle 1634 should be the oldest science puzzle in the tally.)

bkoep's picture
User offline. Last seen 5 hours 31 min ago. Offline
Joined: 11/15/2012
Groups: None

Just a quick update: we still haven't figured out why the group pages are failing to update automatically. But we have found an easy way for site admins to flush some caches manually and cause the group pages to update. For the time being, we're trying to keep things up-to-date by doing this manually whenever a puzzle closes, but if you see them go out of sync, please send a PM to me or jflat06.

I'm definitely concerned about the discrepancies that Loci found from his calculations. Can you forward the full spreadsheet to me? (See your PMs)

bkoep's picture
User offline. Last seen 5 hours 31 min ago. Offline
Joined: 11/15/2012
Groups: None

I think that Loci's discrepancies are due to the same issue, where group pages were not updating. I believe the values in the "Foldit total" column were drawn from the individual group pages, which were way out of sync with the actual values. These are liable to keep falling out of sync until we pin down the issue, although we'll do our best to keep them up-to-date.

In the meantime, the rankings on the Groups page seem to be updating correctly, and should always be accurate.

Thank you LociOiling for your hard work tracking this down! If anyone continues to see problems, please let us know!

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

Here's an interim update, reflecting puzzle 1638 to 1684, 22 February 2019 to 22 June 2019. I debated whether to include puzzle 1637, which expired on 21 February at 23:00 GMT. I collected these results today at 18:20-19:20 GMT. Adding puzzle 1637 didn't seem to help the confusion, so I left it out, but I'll recheck in a couple of days to get a clearer window.

As before, the table below can be copied and pasted into the spreadsheet of your choice, which will improve the formatting. Full spreadsheet available on request.

The first three columns were taken from the Foldit Groups page, also known as "Top Groups".

The "Individual Groups Page" column was taken from the each group's page. Once again, there's no agreement between the two sources.

The "Screen Scraped Scores" column was taken from the "show_scores" page for each group. Once again, this was just an update to the previous spreadsheets. The table has been sorted in descending order on this column.

There's only one match in the entire table. The score shown for Hold My Beer on the Top Groups page matches my screen-scraped results.

A difference of 100 points or so might reflect one science puzzle being counted wrong. I'm having a harder time with the large differences of 300 points or more.

Rank	Group	Top Groups Page	Individual Group Page	Top – Individual	Screen Scraped Scores	Top – SSS	Individual – SSS
#1	Beta Folders	3208	3367	-159	3307	-99	60
#2	Anthropic Dreams	3140	3178	-38	3143	-3	35
#4	Gargleblasters	2732	2649	83	2980	-248	-331
#3	Go Science	2864	2660	204	2972	-108	-312
#5	Contenders	1139	1324	-185	1405	-266	-81
#7	Void Crushers	940	921	19	1044	-104	-123
#6	L'Alliance Francophone	942	1018	-76	939	3	79
#10	Hun-Magyar Csapat	450	522	-72	922	-472	-400
#9	Russian team	461	459	2	795	-334	-336
#8	Marvin's bunch	780	814	-34	781	-1	33
#11	Hold My Beer	406	416	-10	406	0	10
LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

Here's the latest, with numbers collected before 1687 expired.

Since the last update, bkoep got things updated, so the global score on the Groups page now matches what is shown on each individual group page. There's now a whole column of zeroes, long may it last.

Bkoep also noted that beginner puzzle points are not included in a group's global points. (Individual players do receive global points for beginner puzzles.) I removed all the beginner puzzles, and also any other puzzles that awarded zero points.

The screen-scraped scores below include 49 puzzles, from 1639 to 1686. Hold My Beer sat out puzzles 1684 and 1652, but the other groups played all 49. As before, my assumption is that puzzles that expired in the last 120 days are counted in global points totals.

Despite everything, the screen scrapings don't agree with what's shown on the group pages. Gargleblasters shows an especially large discrepancy, 207 points. I re-scraped the G-blasters score, but got the same results again.

As before, you can copy the table below and paste into a spreadsheet for better formatting.

Rank	Group	Global Score	Individual Group Page	Top – Individual	Screen Scraped Scores	Top – SSS	Individual – SSS
#1	Beta Folders	3208	3208	0	3207	1	1
#2	Anthropic Dreams	3140	3140	0	3085	55	55
#3	Go Science	2864	2864	0	2755	109	109
#4	Gargleblasters	2732	2732	0	2525	207	207
#5	Contenders	1139	1139	0	1139	0	0
#6	L'Alliance Francophone	942	942	0	942	0	0
#7	Void Crushers	940	940	0	907	33	33
#8	Marvin's bunch	780	780	0	778	2	2
#9	Russian team	461	461	0	460	1	1
#11	Hold My Beer	406	406	0	406	0	0
#10	Hun-Magyar Csapat	450	450	0	380	70	70
LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

The fact that beginner puzzles don't count toward a group's global points was already documented here:

https://foldit.fandom.com/wiki/Foldit_rankings

That info probably came from a source on the Foldit website, will track that down next.

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

Here are the latest results, gathered 7/16/19 starting at 2100 GMT, and finishing 7/17/19 at 0330 GMT.

Anthropic Dreams is now #1, despite a slight discrepancy between the total shown on the web site and my screen-scraped totals.

Beta Folders is second, based on my screen-scraped numbers, but shows as third place on fold.it.

There are large discrepancies for Go Science and Gargleblasters, comparing the web site totals to my screen scraping.

Once again, the global scores on the Groups page match what is shown on each individual group page.

As before, the numbers below will look better if copied and pasted into a spreadsheet. Complete spreadsheet available on request.

The table is sorted in descending order by the "Screen Scraped Scores" column.

Rank	Group	Global Score	Individual Group Page	Top – Individual	Screen Scraped Scores	Top – SSS	Individual – SSS
#1	Anthropic Dreams	3137	3137	0	3129	8	8
#3	Beta Folders	2995	2995	0	2994	1	1
#2	Go Science	3001	3001	0	2892	109	109
#4	Gargleblasters	2723	2723	0	2516	207	207
#5	Contenders	956	956	0	956	0	0
#6	L'Alliance Francophone	905	905	0	905	0	0
#7	Marvin's bunch	851	851	0	833	18	18
#7	Void Crushers	851	851	0	818	33	33
#10	Russian team	416	416	0	415	1	1
#9	Hun-Magyar Csapat	429	429	0	359	70	70
#11	Hold My Beer	339	339	0	335	4	4
LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 3 hours 40 min ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

Just for penance, I did fresh screen-scraping for Go Science, Gargleblasters, and Contenders in a new spreadsheet.

I used the spreadsheet formula below to exclude beginner puzzles in this version. Prior versions relied on manually deleting the rows for beginner puzzles.

This method produced the same "screen scraped" totals shown above for the three groups in question.

The formula below says "if the puzzle description does not contain "Begin" (an error) set the value to the puzzle score, else set it to zero".

=IF(ISERROR(FIND("Begin";A1));D1;0)
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