Recent best hot key.

Case number:845813-984423
Topic:Game: Tools
Opened by:DisposableHeart
Status:Closed
Type:Suggestion
Opened on:Tuesday, February 10, 2009 - 05:20
Last modified:Wednesday, June 1, 2011 - 16:21

I think in the new version Recent best is much more often used than Very best. Recent best should be the same as very best, unless set otherwise. (Maybe this is already in this way, I couldn't check not being able to increase my score since a while on the current puzzles.)

Therefore: I would like the hotkey 'A' being assigned to recent best, Ctrl-A to very best.

Using Ctrl-N is just painful and not ergonomic. It either requires both hands, or stretching the fingers too much.

I'd like to get back to the single left handed operations for the most frequently used commands.

Thanks,
Peter

(Tue, 02/10/2009 - 05:20  |  13 comments)


xiando's picture
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content.

for now, all of us should be represented in the selection of hotkeys, don;t you think?...I personally don't think ctrl-n is that difficult a move.

I've already seen the hotkeys change to suit the few and would rather this be maintained until such time as there are player defineable hotkeys.

And I've been around the block enough times to know that in any application in which there are two or three dozen (24-36) hotkeys, one simply can't have everything done by a single key depress in one small area of the keyboard. something has to give.

We all have to do things we don't want to do. I can (and have, quite recently in fact) learned to use hotkeys I neither wanted or want and especially didn't expect to have to relearn, just because one or two other people requested them...and I would hope that you could too :)

Joined: 05/19/2008
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So you're saying that you are more happy to use Ctrl-N than 'A'.

I second that! You are right, it is much more easy!

But seriously! I use 6 keys on the keyboard: W, A, S, Z, R and Space. All of them left handed in a way that I don't have to lift my resting hand. Now Ctrl-N is not only requires to lift my hand but also stretching it. Plus, I am not sure I can hit both keys blind, while all left handed keys I can.

I know I am a difficult guy, but please give it a thought this time instead of rejecting or questioning anything I say.

Thank you,
Peter

xiando's picture
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what you're saying out-of-hand...but I do question whether your interests coincide with mine at times. I think that what you're saying has merit...for you. but not for me. And not for ALL players. sometimes you get the keys you want..sometimes you get the keys others want...it's what i've encountered, so why not you?

When user defined hotkeys become available this will be moot.

and your method is not always compatible with mine. until such time as user defined hotkeys are implemented, I would rather have a give-and-take than an I capitulate I capitulate I capitulate you win situation. I rather like the use of ctrl-shift-key and ctrl-key for these purposes, and N is fine by me. better than trying to push all the controls to one side of the keyboard because someone else is too lazy to use two hands or a pinky and thumb.

as you intimate above, are you blind? Or paralyzed? Am I to understand that you're legally blind and cannot hit the right keys otherwise or cannot lift your hand? If so, then we need to really rethink the whole thing to make it easier for you. Perhaps an eye tracking device can be ported to use foldit to assist you. if you're paralyzed you likely already have access. And if you're blind, I'm quite amazed at your folding abilities. I wouldn't expect a blind person to be able to fold very effectively, although perhaps that smacks of arrogance on my part..

Joined: 05/19/2008
Groups: None

My mother tongue is not English, but I believe you understood what I meant by typing blind. I checked the internet and found that English people use this term for typing without watching the keyboard. If it has a default different meaning, then please forgive misleading use of this term.

I am not blind. I am a software engineer interested in software usability, ergonomy, and user interface design. I designed and built software for years for computer illiterates and people with little education.

If you are a self-appointed customer service person on behalf of the project your rumbling about me being blind is simply rude. If you are just a fellow folder, it is not appropriate.
Your words are offensive, but I am not offended only because I cannot take you seriously.

With my best regards to you and those you represent,
Peter

xiando's picture
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I actually thought you were beating around the bush about some physical problem that keeps you from being able to do things like others do  And I guess I should not have given you that leeway in my reply. you may believe whatever you like...My intent was pure and honest. I *was being serious, and and I'm disapointed in myself for second guessing my original read of your post to include that possibility. I was right the first time around. just more condescending bully talk from the illustrious Disposable. Heart.

And. I am personally offended that you are again using your cynical attitude once again to try to manipulate the situation to your advantage. You say nothing in support of that concept, just beat your virtual fist against the wall and send another of your snide comments about the inability of the world tyo serve you your porridge at just the right temperature so you can be spoon fed the muck. In fact, you rarely if ever address any points made except the ones to which you can reply "i don't speak the language" or that you can turn into a reason to insult with condescension. I at least attempt to use logic and thought-out reasoning for the most part.

As I've said on many occasions, user defined hotkeys would solve these problems quite handily. Until then if you can actually think of a suggestion and carry it thru to completion without simply playing the"i don't speak the language card, so you have to do what I say even though half my request is obvious and pure insult and the other half is vague and nebulous and outside the original scope of the project's intended purpose" maybe, just maybe then I'll value your cynicism a bit more.

You have been quite clear that you want to automate the application. You have been quite clear that you think everyone but you is a moron, deserving only of following your vague, half thought-out suggestions. And you've been quite clear on many other aspects of your supposed superiority.. What you don't realize is that many of the tools you use are the result of others efforts...give and take DH. 

We can make it as personal as you want to. if you want to do it that way. I am no stranger to conflict and am quite capable of handling you or anyone else that attempts to wield these bully games as your weapon of choice.

I'm not your servant. I think about these issues, do the associated homework, and propose new tools with detail because of my interest in the project. And many of them apparently are good ideas and well within the scope of the project's intended direction,. because they are both implemented and because you and others are using them to suceeed within the game without thought as to where they came from or how they got there. If you don't like it, tough. People outside the aqsrz crowd should be represented as well.

One more time: User-defined hotkeys will resolve these issues once and for all.  And get off your "high horse". you have done well in the puzzles (while others handle the silly issues of augmenting the application by thinking in detail about how to actually do things) but you have provided VERY little in terms of the game's development for the Larger use base. And your suggestions are almost always self-centered suggestions with no thought to the larger project goals. Plain and simple.

If you want a fight, I'll fight. you or an army. Just as I did during the solo/group score issue.  Single handedly if required. You don't scare me and you can't bully me. You're just a loud lazy voice that serves to remind me of the slacker generation.

If you want to discuss, we can do that as well. Without the constant use of your favorite barbed comentary.

Madde's picture
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I agree with DH. The most commonly used commands should be assigned to single keys on the left side of the keyboard so you can use your left hand for the shortcuts and your right hand for the mouse.

It's the ergonomics, stupid! ;)

Brick's picture
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that Ctrl-N is awkwawrd and uncomfortable to use.  
I can see that it would work for people who use a mouse with their left hand, but then the rest of the hotkeys need to be re-mapped to the right-side of the keyboard..  

xiando's picture
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Perhaps so. And user-defineable hotkeys will go a long way to resolving those issues., Until then one person will suffer at another's behest on the hotkey issue.

I'm glad you like the feature enough to complain about the hotkey used for it. I worked a long time to get this included, from the moment I first proposed it to the users in chat and fought with the immediate resistance to change and cynicism regarding it's perceived "fluff" value at the time to it's subsequent implementation six months after my first post on the subject, and it's a good feeling to know that my original concept was valid and will provide players with another great tool for folding.

Of course much thanks goes out to the development team for doing the real work involved, and their infinite patience with me during the process..

Joined: 05/19/2008
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What can I say... Irony and sarcasm are not cynicism. It may hurt though, sorry for that.

I gave up the API and folding automation since someone from the team explained they are not interested in best fold results, but to figure out HOW humans fold. I can go with it. Maybe if someone explained from the team why Ctrl-N is the best hotkey for one of the most often used functions, I definitely could go with it.

My vague and half thought-out suggestions are suggestions. I don't think I should elaborate them, unless someone from the team is interested in giving a second thought, or other folders support an idea and help them work out. Too bad that this issue came up, being the bad guy that gives suggestions, even if vague or half thought-out ones. Very encouraging to fellow folders, right?

I cannot see how you concluded to that strong statement, saying I was clear that I think everyone is a moron but me. But I am not asking for explanation.

Please don't hate me so much. I don't think I gave you any reasons to do that.

The other personal notes I'd like to leave without a comment. You resolve your issues, I resolve mine.

I'd like to apologize to everyone for turning this hotkey issue a nightmare.

Thank you,
Peter

axcho's picture
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Just to clarify, we've actually started on the macro language / API thing for Foldit. There's a grad student working on it. It's going to happen.

I think it is reasonable to want all the hotkeys as easily accessible as possible. The best solution I think would be to have user-definable hotkeys, which should resolve all past and future hotkey-related complaints. In the meantime I may change the New Best default hotkey, or add a second hotkey to it.

Judecca's picture
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How about a switch in general options, similar to the one that switches right click/middle click?
The switch will change a/ctrl-b with ctrl-n.
One mode will allow users to keep things the way they are, ctrl-b is always "very best" and ctrl-n (or some better hotkey) is the current best.
While the other mode (like the dev preview) allows you to set ctrl-b as "current best" and use another hotkey or the undo buttons if you need to restore your "very best". the second mode would probably be more usefull if you feel stuck and must restart, ctrl-b and A would then function as the "current best" for that new start.

Customizable hotkeys would solve all of these problems in the long run,but a switch should be something that can be thrown in the next update with little work.

xiando's picture
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that's a reasonable solution for the interim, until the developers include player definable hotkeys.

Joined: 06/17/2010
Status: Open » Closed

All shortcuts in help :) Closing.

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