DEVPREV - intro puzzle Insertion and Deletion next to impossible

Case number:954892-2005299
Topic:Developer Preview
Opened by:LociOiling
Status:Closed
Type:Question
Opened on:Wednesday, May 23, 2018 - 19:29
Last modified:Monday, July 30, 2018 - 20:33

After my third or fourth try, my best was only 8,349 out of 8,500 needed.

Part of the problem is that mutate all (M) is very slow, and leaves hydrophobics on the surface as noted in other feedbacks. Also, M is very slow to stop in some cases.

On another attempt, I added two segments, and went through a lot of steps with manually mutating, banding, and so on. Then after deleting a segment, I was able to complete the puzzle.

That success is proving difficult to replicate, marking this one as "bug".

(Wed, 05/23/2018 - 19:29  |  7 comments)


LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 16 min 20 sec ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders
Type: Bug » Question

After restarting Foldit, I was able to complete this puzzle by following the wiki instructions.

http://foldit.wikia.com/wiki/Intro_Puzzles/Insertion_and_Deletion

The trick is to insert *two* segments at the spot suggested by the popup, then wiggle, then mutate.

Not sure why it was so difficult on the first attempts, where I did try inserting two.

Downgrading this feedback to a question pending further investigation.

jflat06's picture
User offline. Last seen 5 days 2 hours ago. Offline
Joined: 09/29/2010
Groups: Window Group

Thanks for all these feedbacks! These are all very helpful.

The devs implementing the changes have seen them and should be addressing them.

joshmiller's picture
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Joined: 09/08/2017
Groups: Go Science

Hi Loci, I just tried this puzzle for myself as well. It seemed pretty forgiving when I tried multiple strategies to win, so I think it's okay for now. But we'll monitor it and see if players are getting stuck here. Thanks for letting us know about this.

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 16 min 20 sec ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

I played through all the intro puzzles again today on 20180516-f28783403a-win_x86-devprev, and Insertion and Deletion was once again a problem, although I got through it eventually.

The puzzle seems much easier with freshly started client. Trying playing each intro puzzle in sequence to recreate.

Based on the inconsistent behavior, I'd suspect there's some problem with global variables not getting reset for each puzzle.

joshmiller's picture
User offline. Last seen 6 days 4 hours ago. Offline
Joined: 09/08/2017
Groups: Go Science

What exactly was a problem about the puzzle this time?

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 16 min 20 sec ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders

It's inconsistent.

With a freshly started client, I did insert one between, wiggle, and mutate. The score reached the required 8,500 during the mutate. The result was 48 moves in 1:26.

When I tried playing the design levels, again with a fresh client, the same procedure did not work. Additional shake and wiggle didn't clear it. Finally, I nudged the helix a bit and wiggled, and that did it. Something like 70 moves and about 3:30. This was not the worst experience I've had with this puzzle.

The next time around, again after playing the other design levels first, Insertion and Deletion surrendered easily as before.

The inconsistent results seem like a problem, especially since doesn't seem like a "skill" puzzle (hand-eye coordination not a factor), but just a quick introduction to a new tool.

LociOiling's picture
User offline. Last seen 16 min 20 sec ago. Offline
Joined: 12/27/2012
Groups: Beta Folders
Status: Open » Closed

Closing this one, seems better with 20180725-d14dae34c3-win_x86-devprev.

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